‘Actors in a reality show presidency’: MS NOW hosts react to Trump's 'clown car' Cabinet

So first they got rid of Gregory Bovino, the little guy who lives in a shoe, who was inexplicably promoted well beyond his job title to lead Donald Trump's chaotic, violent, trigger-happy, inept paramilitary invasions of multiple U.S. cities. They got rid of him. Then they got rid of Kristi Noem, the secretary of homeland security. Also, technically, they also got rid—at the same time, they got rid of the guy who

didn't formally work for the Department of Homeland Security, but nevertheless, he was there every day and at all of her events, sitting or standing right next to her, and he was definitely, definitely, definitely not her boyfriend, because she is super happily married. Then, of course, we immediately got some quite unexpected news about that aforementioned marriage.

And then we got the multi-million dollar luxury private jet that she and her not-boyfriend procured with taxpayer funds for what they said would be high-profile deportations. The private jet with the bar and the queen-size bed. Then we learned that the Homeland Security Department would not be keeping that jet after all. The White House instead would be taking it, and now it was going to be used by other cabinet

members and also, for some reason, by Melania Trump. Investigations into the not-boyfriend of Kristi Noem demanding payments from companies with Homeland Security contracts reportedly continue. The not-boyfriend, of course, denies all wrongdoing. But then they got rid of the attorney general. She only barely made it a year.

In that time, she did reduce the U.S. Department of Justice to a smoking hulk. But apparently she was just getting started when they got rid of her. She had just moved into some general's house. Because the true mark of making it in the upper echelons of this administration is that you're allowed to essentially loot from the U.S. military. You're allowed to just take over military housing for yourself because, hey, some of it's quite nice. But right after she got

moved into some general's house, Attorney General Pam Bondi was out. Then they got rid of the director of ICE following reports that he had had to be hospitalized not once but twice since taking the job because of stress. Plus another incident in which a security detail reportedly retrieved a portable defibrillator from a nearby office because he was freaking out so hard they were sure they were going to have to shock him. Last week the

head of ICE Todd Lyons found himself unable to answer basic questions from Democratic Congresswoman Lauren Underwood of Illinois as she pressed him on why so many people have been dying in ICE custody. He could not answer her questions from Democratic Congresswoman Lauren Underwood of Illinois as she pressed him on why so many people have been dying in ICE custody. He could not answer her basic questions about those deaths, even basic questions about why those deaths weren't being investigated.

And then as soon as that, I'm sure, very stressful hearing was over, we learned that he's out too. He has resigned and he will be gone next month. Well, now today, another one down. The Secretary of Labor is out. And where do you want to start with this one? In January, the New York Post was first to report on a complaint about Trump's Labor Secretary that had been made to the department's Inspector General. And I got to tell you, the New York Post has since done a ton of groundbreaking reporting

on this scandal at Trump's Labor Department. But because it's the New York Post and I'm going to show you some of their reporting, I feel like I just have to mention at the outset that they do decide to decorate much of their reporting on this scandal with photos of Trump's Labor Secretary in a bikini. Like, I mean, not every article, but a lot of their reporting on this scandal with photos of Trump's labor secretary in a bikini. Like, I mean, not every article, but a lot of their articles about this just randomly have pictures of her in a bikini.

And I don't—I just—that's just kind of the business model over there. But the reporting is what it is. Trump's labor secretary, Lori Chavez de Riemer, faced allegations of drinking in the office during the workday, and of taking staff members to strip clubs, and of taking personal trips at taxpayer expense.

She was accused of pursuing a sexual relationship with a member of her security detail. That member of her security detail was then put on leave, then he resigned, then her chief of staff was forced out,, then her chief of staff was forced out, then her deputy chief of staff was forced out, then her director of advance was forced out.

Then we learned that her husband—hey, there's a husband!—he was banned from going inside the Labor Department's headquarters building. That ban on him entering the building came after two Labor Department staff members accused him, the secretary's husband, of sexually assaulting them at the Labor Department headquarters building. The husband denies wrongdoing, but then the hits just kept coming. Last week, the New York Times was first to report on Trump's Labor secretary allegedly sending text messages to her employees during the workday,

telling them to bring her wine. The Times says it has reviewed the messages and that they're part of an inspector general investigation. We here at MSNOW have not reviewed the messages and have not independently confirmed this reporting, but this is what the Times says, quote,

in one text message, Ms. Chavez de Remer asked a staff member to bring Rosé to her hotel room. The messages are undated, but a picture of the menu in the text message exchange suggests it comes from a hotel bar in Myrtle Beach, South Carolina, where the Labor Secretary went on an official visit last July. She asked, quote, do they sell by the bottle? And it wasn't just the wine, the alleged day drinking, and having Labor Department employees bring her wine for day drinking.

This is also from the Times, quote, Ms. Chavez-DeRemer's husband and father exchanged text messages with young female staff members at the Labor Department. Some of the young women were instructed by the Labor secretary herself to, quote, pay attention, to, quote, pay attention to her husband and father. In an April 2025 exchange provided to investigators, Ms. Chavez-DeRemer's father wrote to a young female Labor Department staff member, quote,

Hearing you are in town, wishing you would let me know. I could have made some excuses to get out and show you around. Please keep this private. The young female Labor Department staff member responded, quote, will do, no need to worry. She apologized to him for not reaching out. He responded, quote, when are you leaving and where are you staying?

This is the Labor secretary's father. She allegedly told her young female staffers that they needed to, quote, pay attention to him. When are you leaving and where are you staying? Three Labor Department staff members have filed civil rights complaints against Trump's Labor secretary and the department, describing a hostile work environment.

But now Trump's labor secretary is out, too. As of tonight, Trump labor secretary Lori Chavez-DeRimer is out of her job. Her lawyer told us here at MSNOW tonight, quote, Secretary Chavez-DeRimer did not resign due to findings that she violated the law. Her decision to leave office was personal. You know, personally, I think it's got a sting that I don't think they ever gave her a general's house. I mean, not like everybody else in the Cabinet. I don't think she ever got one.

Not even like an admiral's house. But now she's out as well. That said, the FBI director still has his job. The deputy director of the FBI, the podcaster guy, they got rid of him, but the other podcaster guy is still there in the director's job, after learning about Director Kash Patel assigning the FBI SWAT team to be personal bodyguards for his girlfriend, after Director Kash Patel flew the FBI private jet to the Olympics so the taxpayers could pay for him to go to Italy

and chug beer in the hockey team's locker room. FBI Director Kash Patel has now filed a lawsuit and a demand for $250 million against The Atlantic magazine following The Atlantic reporting this weekend on what reporter Sarah Fitzpatrick described as his, quote, conspicuous inebriation. Quote, several officials told me that Patel's drinking has been a recurring source of concern across the government.

They said he is known to drink to the point of obvious intoxication, in many cases at the private club Ned's in Washington, D.C., while in the point of obvious intoxication in many cases at the private club Ned's in Washington DC while in the presence of White House and other administration staff. Patel is also known to drink to excess at the Poodle Room in Las Vegas where he frequently spends parts of his weekends. Early in his tenure meetings and briefings had to be rescheduled for later in the day as a result of his alcohol-fueled nights," said

six current and former officials and others familiar with Patel's schedule. Quote, on multiple occasions in the past year, members of Patel's security detail had difficulty waking him because he was seemingly intoxicated, according to information supplied to Justice Department and White House officials. A request for breaching equipment, normally used by SWAT and hostage rescue teams to quickly gain entry into buildings, was made last year because Director Kash Patel had been unreachable

behind locked doors. According to multiple people familiar with the request, some of Patel's colleagues at the FBI worry his personal behavior has become a threat to public safety. FBI officials and others in the administration have privately questioned whether alcohol played a role, for example, in the multiple instances in which Patel has shared inaccurate information with the public about active law enforcement

investigations, including following the murder of Charlie Kirk. The Atlantic says its reporter spoke with more than two dozen sources for this story. MSNOW has not independently verified these allegations. Mr. Patel has denied all wrongdoing. He's now suing the Atlantic over this story, calling it malicious and defamatory. But for now, at least, he remains in his job at the FBI, with the speculative odds on how quickly podcaster Kash Patel might be fired from that job hinging somewhat on the question

of how much alcohol remains in the news about Trump's FBI director, since President Donald Trump is somewhat famously averse to drunkenness. Hey, Pete Hexeth, still on the job as defense secretary as the supposed ceasefire in Iran comes to an end.

Good evening from New York, I'm Chris Hayes. Well, the tenure of the worst secretary of Homeland Security since the agency was formed has come to an end in spectacular and humiliating fashion. Kristi Noem, and we assume her special government friend, Corey Lewandowski, are out. Fired today on Truth Social by Donald Trump, quote, the current Secretary, Kristi Noem, who has served us well and has had numerous and spectacular results, especially on the

border, will be moving to be special envoy for the Shield of the Americas, a thing I didn't know existed until today. Our new security initiative in the Western Hemisphere, we are announcing on Saturday in Doral, Florida. I thank Christie for her service at Homeland. He also announced her replacement.

That would be current Oklahoma Senator Mark Wayne Mullen, the guy who has been all over cable news in the past week for some reason, although we all know who else watches a lot of cable news. He may be no better, but tonight is for reflecting on the end of Christine Ohm's ignominious cabinet career. She made it 14 months, almost exactly as long as cricket, the deer-departed dog she bragged about shooting in her memoir. Christine, with tenure,

is ending in complete humiliation. You could see from the look on her face this week as she was grilled by members of both parties, she very much looked like someone who knew she was in danger of losing her job.

And you could be forgiven for finding it all satisfying, considering just how corrupt and vile DHS has been under Nome's watch. From defending the violence and mass raids and kidnappings that have come to dominate headlines for a year, to posing in the Salvadoran gulag where she deported hundreds of men with

zero process, using them as props as they rotted behind her while the gold Rolex on her wrist glinted in the light. To staging elaborate photo ops of herself armed and on fast boats and joining raids to create social media content. To slandering Renee Good and Alex Pretty, Americans who were shot and killed in broad daylight on camera by her masked agents. A slander that she didn't even have the decency to take back yesterday under questioning

from House Judiciary Member Jamie Raskin.

You stated the conclusion two hours after they were killed that they were domestic terrorists. I wanted to give you an opportunity to correct the record, not just for their family, but for everybody in America

who believes in the truth and fairness and honesty.

In every situation, as facts come out, we relay them.

You know, your acting ICE director, Todd Lyons, came before Congress. He said he had no knowledge whatsoever that Alex Pretty and Renee Good were domestic terrorists. None. This is your guy.

He said that. He admitted that that was wrong. Why won't you admit it?

I will tell you, the investigation is still ongoing. And we'll...

So do you regret speaking before the investigation?

I would say that in those situations...

You regret that?

...the chaotic scene on the ground, we relay information to the American people that they're asking for.

And as things change, situations change...

People were asking you whether they were domestic terrorists? And you decided that they were before the investigation? As we learn more, we can... Do you want to say anything to their families?

I did. I said, I'm...

Condolences.

For what?

I'm hurt.

How about an apology for what you said

about their loved ones?

My heart is with them and we will continue to stand with them as they get a complete investigation into these situations.

All right. But it appears why all of those things contributed to her termination, and they really did. It wasn't any of those things specifically that actually was the thing that got Nome fired, the straw that broke the camel's proverbial back. It wasn't because she oversaw multiple Americans, multiple Americans being shot and killed, not just Renee Good and Alex Pretty, including one we just found out about in Texas, many months after the fact because DHS apparently hid it.

And it wasn't because so many people have died under the custody of ICE, the organization that she manages. That includes a Haitian man who died in an Arizona detention center Monday after officials denied him any treatment

for a tooth infection for weeks, according to his brother. Noam was not even fired over the $70 million Boeing 737 Max 8 luxury jet that she reportedly used for private travel along with the special government employee acting as her de facto number two, Corey Lewandowski. Does, however, appear to have something to do with that now notorious $220 million DHS

media contract for Gnome to cut a series of ads like this.

Anyone who searches for freedom can always find a home here, but that freedom is a precious thing and we defend it vigorously. You cross the border illegally, we'll find you. Break our laws, we'll punish you. Break our laws, we'll punish you. Harm American citizens, there will be consequences. But if you come here the right way,

your American dream can be as big as these endless skies. From President Trump and me, welcome home.

Oh, I'm sorry, is that you there? Sorry, you just caught me on my horse amidst this gorgeous view. Nearly a quarter of a billion dollars in taxpayer money was set aside for that kind of stuff. And as ProPublica reported last summer,

most of it went in a no-bid process to a Republican consulting firm with, you guessed it, longstanding ties to Noam and her aides. Lewandowski worked extensively with the firm. In fact, the CEO of that firm is married to Nome's recently departed DHS spokeswoman, Huda Thunk.

Nome spent the last two days on the Hill insisting to members of commerce she did not have anything to do with the contract personally and anyway, it had the president's blessing.

The president approved ahead of time, you spending $220 million running TV ads across the country in which you are featured prominently.

Yes, sir. We went through the legal processes. Did it correct?

Did the president know you were going to do this?

Yes.

Did the president know you were going to do this? Yes. That may have been the thing. That was her stepping on the landmine. It appears at least. That's the thing. That was her stepping on the landmine. It appears, at least. That's the story.

This morning, Reuters got Trump on the phone and he told them, quote, I never knew anything about it. Reuters went on to say shortly after the president commented then he posted to Truth Social that Noem would be replaced. Apparently suggesting he had approved her wildly corrupt, self-glorifying propaganda campaign. Well, that was it. That was a bridge too far. Who's telling the truth? Who knows? Donald Trump, Kristi Noem.

Still, what is clear is Trump pays attention to the news and public opinion, and both were bad for none. As one White House official made quite clear to Fox News reporter Peter Doocy in a text today.

What I am about to read is both spicy and not subtle. The text reads as follows. It was time. The text reads as follows. including CBP and ICE. Christie's drama sadly overshadowed and distracted from the administration's extremely popular immigration agenda, which will continue full force.

Now, of course, we have not independently confirmed that reporting from Ducey, son of Ducey, but it is useful here because it is all spin. The White House knows they had a problem. That's a testament to, first of all, really good accountability reporting.

I mean, investigative pieces in ProPublica and Wall Street Journal, as well as local and independent outlets. I mean, local papers did an incredible job in Los Angeles and Chicago and Minnesota. Across the country, tracking DHS, documenting its activities

and combined with that, thanks to public outcry and organizing and protests and dissent from ordinary Americans against those activities. I mean, think about this, right? Remember when they sent all those people to the Gulag in El Salvador, hundreds of illegally disappeared men? They got released from that CICOT camp in Salvador, even though they, Christine Ohm said they'd never be released. And then they deployed to Los Angeles and Chicago and DHS had to roll back its operations in both those places. It had to admit defeat

in Minneapolis, greatly reduce its surge there, although there are still many, many more agents than Tom Homan said there would be. We have our eyes on that. But they lost a bunch. And now the person who oversaw those losses. Well, she's gotten just a little bit of a come up. Come up. Maryland Congressman Jamie Raskin serves as the ranking member on the Judiciary Committee, where he led yesterday's grilling of Chrissy Noem. And he joins me now. First, Congressman, your reaction to the news.

Well, there's a little bit of exhilaration and satisfaction that we were able to move working on. I mean, there have been dozens of injuries and deaths under her leadership of ICE, and we need to turn that situation around. I mean, it is a clear and present danger to the lives of a lot of people who are being swept up in their dragnet policies. But also, $220 million for an PR ad contract. When I first saw it, Chris, I thought it was $220,000, which sounds like the kind of ad, you know, PR contracts I have heard about before. Even that one is pretty handsome. But $220 million, like, that corrupt bargain deal needs to be investigated from top to

bottom as my colleague Joe Neguse was saying yesterday in questioning. We need to investigate the entire thing. And the taxpayers have got to get their money back. But it is riddled with corruption over there. And then I raised the question yesterday of dozens of cases where federal judges have castigated the Department of Homeland Security for lying in affidavits and testimony before the court.

All of that has got to end. All of that's got to stop. I mean, if you just trade one corrupt MAGA clone for another, that's not progress. But if Senator Mullen can come in and actually begin by saying, no, these two victims of ICE killings were not domestic terrorists and that will never happen again, OK, that will be some progress.

And we'd like to see it.

Yeah, I mean, on that, you're obviously in the House and not the Senate. The Senate will have to confirm Mark Mullen. And it's generally the rule, as I'm sure you would agree, and as I've observed over my journalistic career, that fellow senators get pretty wide berth in that body. They're all part of the club.

But it does seem to me, if you're sort of speaking to your colleagues over in the Senate who are going to confirm him, all the things you said, this does seem like a bigger opportunity now for actual congressional oversight, just even in the confirmation hearings, which is all of the things you've said should be precisely at issue

before anyone's just going to say, yeah, go get them, Mark Wayne. His confirmation comes in the immediate aftermath of both chambers of Congress being totally absorbed with the details of her tenure. And so everybody in the Senate will have just been through this. His confirmation hearing should be essentially a continuation of Secretary Noem's questioning. And he should talk about what he's going to do to make a radical break from what has taken place before and to disavow and recant so many of the things

she just said. In terms of getting to the bottom of all this, you mentioned Joe Neguse. This is a pro publica, which again has done great accountability reporting on this, that she misled Congress about her top aides role in DHS contracts. I mean, she said Lewandowski had nothing to do with it, and then they're able to produce a contract that Lewandowski had nothing to do with it, and then they're able to produce a contract that Lewandowski signed.

He's the signature on the contract, her special government employee friend with benefits. So it seems to me that while there has been a lot of reporting, and clearly there's some whistleblowers in DHS, I'm not convinced, and I wonder if you are, that we know the full scope of precisely what went on in DHS for 14 months, precisely who got which contracts under which conditions, and whether there's anything else that hasn't been reported that

we should probably know about. That's absolutely right. And there's tremendous interest in what Lewandowski's role was and how much he participated in decisions about federal government contracts, including that $220 million ad buy contract. I'm a little less interested in the Salacious personal stuff. It almost doesn't make much difference to me

what their personal relationship was. But his public role is fair game, and we need to be investigating that and getting to the bottom of it, and what kind of personnel practices are taking place in the Trump administration. Seems to me that the whole administration

has a staff infection.

We start tonight with a major shakeup at the Department of Justice. President Trump has fired Attorney General Pamela Jo Bondi after just a 14-month tenure leading the DOJ. Bondi is now the second member of Trump's cabinet to be forced out in this second term. Bondi reportedly ended up in the president's crosshairs for a couple of reasons, principally her handling of the DOJ's Epstein files. We'll have more on that later.

Also an issue was her failure to successfully prosecute the president's political foes.

Let's take a look at how some of that played out.

Trump putting extraordinary pressure on his attorney general, Pam Bondi, publicly calling on her to use the power of the Justice Department to prosecute his political enemies.

Notable cases include two failed attempts to

indict New York Attorney General Letitia James. Today's ruling means at least for now both cases

will be dismissed. Federal charges have been dropped against Mayor Razzaracca following his

arrest outside an ICE facility. Bondi is the one who installed Lindsay Halligan as the interim U.S. attorney. That has been invalidated. Both Allegan and Bondi should be disbarred.

Those are just some of the many cases that the DOJ has tried without success to pursue. Here are some more. Judges have pushed back in each case, saying that the challenges themselves lack legal merit. And with any government shakeup,

it seems that breaking up is hard to do. Bondi reportedly did not want to leave her post at DOJ. The New York Times reports that she spent much of yesterday making her case to stay in the Cabinet. Bondi, however, released a statement saying otherwise.

She wrote, quote, that she is thrilled

to be moving to the private sector released a statement saying otherwise. She wrote, quote, that she is thrilled

to be moving to the private sector and will continue fighting for President Trump. Trump announced the shakeup in a Truth Social post, writing that Deputy AG Todd Blanch will serve as acting Attorney General until a new AG is nominated.

Blanch, who was once Trump's personal lawyer, is not without controversy himself. Last year, he conducted a much-discussed interview with Jeffrey Epstein's convicted associate, Ghislaine Maxwell. In the wake of that interview, Maxwell was transferred, without explanation, to a minimum-security prison. Last week, Blanche was at CPAC, where we got a sense of the new acting AGs' priorities.

Take a listen.

I represented President Trump in the Manhattan DA case and in Jack Smith's prosecutions. Why is there objection to sending ICE officers to polling places? Illegals can't vote. We see our most activist judges that we lose to every single day. There's a lot of ways that we can work within that to get some of our cases where we want them to be.

MS Now reports that the president is considering a short list of candidates to replace Bondi and the list includes EPA head Lee Zeldin, Republican Senator Eric Schmidt, and U.S. Attorney Jeanine Pirro, who is currently overseeing a controversial case against Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell.

Joining me now to discuss all of this is Molly Jong Fast, New York Times opinion writer and the host of the Fast Politics podcast. Also with us is Andrew Weissman, former FBI general counsel, former Mueller prosecutor, and an MSNOW legal contributor. Andrew, let's start with you. AG Pamela Jo Bondi is now out. What's your reaction?

So I think there's a temptation in these kinds of stories to focus on the person who was fired. What did they do right? What did they do wrong? And I think that in this instance, that is going to be going straight for the capillaries. I think she is a symptom of what is going on in the White House and specifically the

Oval Office. This Department of Justice was a plaything to Donald Trump. And moving the deck chairs around, shifting who is in charge, is not going to change the policies and practices that are so antithetical to the rule of law. So while she is out, I think that is really not the story. I think they'll — I don't see them putting anyone else in

who's going to adhere to the longtime values of the Department of Justice under Republican and Democratic administrations of being independent of the White House

about who gets charged and who does not get charged.

Mollye, what's your take on this? So, Andrea's basically said that the whole corpus is rotted. It doesn't matter who's at the head. What's your take? That's a fundamental indictment

of the Department of Justice. And from someone who knows what the Department of Justice is supposed to look like. I would say what's meaningful about this is not so much that she's gone, but how she's gone. Remember, Donald Trump made a real point in Trump 2.0 of not firing people. And he would even, Kristi Noem was moved to a really great fake job, right?

The Shields of America.

Which sounded like something from the Marvel Universe.

Yes.

But apparently it's a real thing.

Right. A real thing that they clearly made up. So I do think it's important that this really happened. They did not move her. They just fired her. He fired her via tweet.

We're already seeing leaking, right? She spent yesterday, how do we know she spent yesterday begging for her job because someone leaked it? So we're already seeing leaking. And remember, one of the reasons why Trump tried not to fire people this time is because when he did last time, all anyone did was leak. So the fact that he has done this, done this so quickly,

did not give her a fake job. Even Mike Walls got another job. So I think that is very meaningful. Look, I don't know how he gets someone Senate confirmed again. I guess he's going to have to take another senator.

But the actual movement and this sort of inability to keep someone, I think that's meaningful.

So, Andrea, going back to your bigger point about the rot at the DOJ, one of the reasons the president was apparently so frustrated with Bondi was that she had not done enough, in his view, to secure wins against his perceived enemies. Given that so much of her tenure was spent trying unsuccessfully to prosecute the president's perceived enemies, what's the nature of the legacy that she leaves behind? And what will her successor have to achieve going forward to live up to this president's expectations? Well, I sort of view that as the president

being unwilling to look in the mirror and understand that he had unrealistic expectations. Saying that, oh, she's not effective because she wasn't able to re-indict and then re-indict again, Letitia James, or to indict six members of Congress

for doing the unspeakable, which is speaking the truth and doing so protected by the First Amendment. Those are not failings of the attorney general, other than the attorney general should never have approved them. But another attorney general is not going to do any better.

The problem is the president, not the attorney general. I mean, obviously, the attorney general should not be subservient. They are professional. They should be saying no. But it's really, to me, is the president thinking, oh, there is no such thing as a rule of law. And if I can just get somebody more effective, they can sort of trample on the rule of law better than Pam Bondi did. And I think that ignores the fact that you have grand jurors and you have judges in the system and they can push back and have pushed back on illegal practices.

That's a great point, Molly. I mean, it wasn't that Pamela Joe Bondi didn't try to launch these prosecutions. It's that judges were like, no, that won't fly, or jurors would say, like, we're not going to issue a bill in that case. The New York Times reports, though, that this particular attorney general was a real loyalist.

According to the New York Times, Bondi was, quote, like a radio built to pick up only one channel to Mr. Trump's demands. Ms. Bondi gained and maintained her position through her attentiveness, loyalty, and obedience,

and that makes her uniquely vulnerable to shifts in the president's opinion. I mean, what to say?

Well, this is the Trump 2.0 problem, right? This is a cabinet filled with people who have their jobs because of their fealty to Trump and not much else.

I think it's very hard for women people who have their jobs because of their fealty to Trump and not much else.

I think it's very hard for women to do MAGA. We've seen this again and again. This is something I think we've talked about, too.

We have talked about this, yes.

Yeah, because part of MAGA is this rage, is this ability, like Brett Kavanaugh, during his confirmation hearings, this ability to turn a question on a questioner, to sort of be so angry.

And American women, our culture has not embraced the angry woman as of yet. And MAGA is this hyper-sexualized Mar-a-Lago face, you know, a certain aesthetic, which

really runs contrary to pushing back against a questioner quite that way.

Well, let me push on this. It strikes me that the only two people who have yet to be ousted from this Cabinet are women, and there weren't a lot of women to begin with. And there's some rumblings that maybe the third will be Tulsi Gabbard, the DNI, head of DNI.

What does that say about this administration's interest in protecting and defending women, letting women have a real seat at the table, as it were?

Yeah. Remember in Trump 1.0 where they couldn't, they didn't have enough women and they kept bringing in, like they have Ivanka. I mean, everyone here is like a non-playing character except for Trump. So everybody has been sort of put in there because they're actors. And that he even says such, he even says that he was impressed with Pete Hexeth because of the way he was on television. You know, these people are actors in sort of Trump's

reality show presidency.

Andrew, the DOJ has obviously much changed after Bondi's tenure. Is there any hope that this ship will right? What will need to happen? Whether it's in the next Attorney General's tenure or even beyond that to make the Department of Justice the entity that we have always known it to be in both Republican and Democrat presidents past

That's a nice small question there. I mean, that is a huge, huge issue. Please answer it in one minute. Yes, so first, don't have any hope for Todd Blanch. In many ways, this is not just the firing of Pam Bondi, but it's the snubbing of Todd Blanch. I mean, the normal process would have been to elevate him and propose that he will be the next attorney general.

And so essentially the sins that we've been talking about that are against her are against him as well. And so also I can't imagine a confirmation hearing for him because it would be very much a bloodbath and would put front and center issues like Epstein, which we'll talk about. And so another Justice Department is really going to have a hard time because once you've broken those norms,

there are gonna be people who really think that that's something you can do.

Okay, so I don't know. I feel like things always happen on a Friday,

big stories break on a Friday.

Big stories break on a Friday. And as I just mentioned with Chris, but in case you haven't seen it, there is some breaking news. This absolutely bonkers story that just posted tonight concerning, well, the clown car people who make up Trump's cabinet. And I mean, this time it's really focused on FBI Director Kash Patel.

And it's an explosive new story in The Atlantic that just posted. It cites dozens of FBI sources, which is a big deal. It's not big. It's a lot of sources in this story detailing new allegations about Patel, including some sources who say Patel is frequently drunk on the job,

regularly absent from work, and paranoid about getting fired. And there's quite an anecdote about that we're going to talk about. And I'm just going to read you a few of the key passages because I think that will tell you everything you need to know about this story. Here's one. Several officials told The Atlantic that Patel's drinking has been a recurring source of concern across the government. Early in his tenure, meetings and briefings had to be rescheduled for later in the day. as a result of his alcohol-fueled nights, six current and

former officials and others familiar with Patel's schedule told The Atlantic as a sidebar, not normal, have worked in two administrations. Again, back to the quote, on multiple occasions in the past year members of his security detail had difficulty waking Patel because he was seemingly intoxicated. This was Chris was just referencing. And that's according to information supplied to Justice Department and White House officials.

A request for breaching equipment, normally used by SWAT and hostage rescue teams to quickly gain entry into buildings, was made last year because Patel had been unreachable behind locked doors, according to multiple people familiar with the request. Multiple officials also tell The Atlantic that Patel is deeply concerned that his job is in jeopardy. Well, that's understandable.

And one incident earlier this month, Patel struggled to log into an internal computer system. He quickly became convinced that he had been locked out and he panicked, frantically calling aides and allies to announce that he had been fired by and he panicked, frantically calling aides and allies to announce that he had been fired by the White House, according to nine people familiar with his outreach, nine people. Now, the access problem turned out to, quote, have been a technical error

and it was quickly resolved. And that's according to two people familiar with the matter. Now, I should note, MSNOW has not independently verified any of this reporting. We've reached out to the FBI for comment. And if we get a response over the next hour, I will surely let you know as soon as we get a response. But I should note the FBI responded to The Atlantic with a graceful and eloquent statement attributed to Patel.

And here's what he said.

Print it.

All false. I'll see you in court. Bring your checkbook. Graceful. Eloquent. OK. Joining me now is the reporter who broke that story, staff writer for The Atlantic, Sarah Fitzpatrick.

First of all, Sarah, I'm so grateful you could be here because we saw this story and we reached out. We were like, can you come talk to us about it? And here you are. I just skimmed the story, the top, the service there, I should say. But first, I just want to give you an opportunity to respond to this reaction to your piece, because Patel's advisor, Erica Knight, called your piece fabricated stories. She said that every serious DC reporter passed on, Sarah Fitzpatrick and Jeffrey Goldberg

printed it anyway. Lawsuit is being filed. What do you say to that? I say that I am a very careful, very diligent, award-winning investigative reporter with a history of award-winning work across multiple organizations. You and I, in fact, have worked together previously. I stand by every word of this reporting. We have excellent attorneys and, you know,

it is a surprise, it is a surprising statement, but a very telling statement, I believe, from, and I would also note, we reached out for comment to the White House and to the Justice Department, neither of which disputed anything. We gave multiple opportunities, including 19 detailed, detailed questions.

So we stand by every word, and look, this is telling, because there are so many people, you alluded to it earlier, these are not the types of people who are willing to speak out outside of the FBI, especially right now because Kash Patel is going after people with polygraphs in a way that has never happened at the Bureau. So for it to be this level of alarm, this is people genuinely concerned that America is a

danger as a result of this conduct. And I feel a real responsibility to take care of that reporting incredibly carefully. And the Atlantic is nothing but diligent, and we have amazing lawyers and amazing editors, and I stand by every word. I'm not surprised in any way by their response. I will say, and as you said, you note and I noted nine sources for the opening anecdote

of the story, as well. Let's get into some of the details about this, because Patel's excessive drinking seems to be what is alarming a lot of the sources in here. There are multiple anecdotes that refer to that. That's understandable. They're moving meetings.

People couldn't wake him. What more have you heard about the extent of his drinking habits and how it seems to be affecting his ability to serve as FBI director?

The key point is that this is happening in places in which it is public. There are lots and lots of people around who are seeing it, who are hearing about it, who are learning about it. For example, we have video of Patel chugging a beer to excess on video.

We've all seen it. Everybody's seen it. Yes. And I think it speaks to, you know, he was on official travel at that time. There were ongoing threats in the United States at that time. So you know, it is a very, very clear pattern that has occurred in multiple locations over

a long period of time. And it's that pattern which has given everyone pause. These are not one-off events. One of this, I just read this story but I we have to come back to it because the excerpt I just read just remind people a request for breaching equipment normally used by SWAT and hostage rescue teams to quickly gain entry into buildings was made last year because Patel had been unreachable

behind locked doors according to multiple people familiar with this request. I find that, I mean, I've traveled with two presidents. I've worked in the government. I've worked in the State Department. Shocking, really? People should feel shocked by that. This is not a 22-year-old who's irresponsible, who's on a trip and should be behaving better. This is the FBI director. Can you tell us more just about that scene or paint it for people who have not yet read your story? I think the really most important thing here

is that most national security officials at this caliber or even several layers below, those types of people sleep with their phones on their chest. They are so concerned because they need to be reachable immediately

because there are life or death decisions that have to be made quickly. There may be threats in which they need to be moved quickly and so this timing aspect, the ability to reach that person quickly and make sure that they are responsive, I think this is a request that was not made lightly and I think that the fact that it was made and that it was well-known, I think because of that level of concern,

really tells you about the kind of larger picture here. And look, you have us, the FBI is, you and I both know so many people that have given their lives to this organization. This is a place protecting- Are still giving their lives, to be clear. Are still giving their lives. Yes, and the threats have never been higher.

The risks have never been higher. And so you have a group of people that have totally, like, the biggest fear would be that something could happen to this person. And I think they take that responsibility incredibly seriously. But that's not, that goes beyond the entire organization. You have an organization that is dependent on this person being available, being cogent,

and being able to quickly respond to multiple things all at the same time.

The opening anecdote of the story was incredibly striking for a number of reasons. I mean, because you described this freakout in which he, Patel, was intoxicated. He thinks he was locked out of an F&M.

To be clear, he wasn't.

He was not in that case. He was not intoxicated. He thinks he was locked out of an FBI. To be clear, he wasn't. He was not in that case.

He was not intoxicated. It just broke somewhere. I'm trying to remember all the details of it. Thank you for correcting me there. But he thought he was locked out of an FBI computer system. He grew incredibly paranoid, thought he was going to be of lead with that anecdote in the story. The anecdote was just incredibly telling for a couple of reasons. One is that it set off such a panic within the FBI and within Washington.

It set off a panic in Congress. The White House was fielding calls. I mean, there was a real lack of understanding about who was in charge at a given moment, which, as you know, as a former member of government, is an incredibly important who is in charge at a given moment. But I also think it speaks to character and impulsivity and the ability to be in a stressful situation and think about what those next steps are.

And I think it is also emblematic of other occasions that we have seen that are very public in which information has been shared by the FBI director, which was not yet, that went beyond what the investigation was ready to make public at that time, and that later had to be walked back. And in multiple cases that we have seen,

all very publicly reported, the fact that this has impacted the investigation, this has impacted their ability to pursue people that were potentially mass shooters or other things of that nature. So I think it's just a very telling anecdote, but it's not unusual for those that are familiar

with his behavior and his temperament. Erratic is not what you want in that job. They need stability, and that's what you want in that job. They need stability and that's what you need in that job.

But also remember that there's a bit of an irony here, which is that one of the major purposes within our legal system is that the FBI comes in often when you are in court and comes in and they are providing the information, swearing that it is fact under law. There's so much work that goes on into putting a fact into the public record in a lawsuit. And so, again, the jumping ahead of waiting for verification

is just incredibly telling. Because every other FBI employee, if they were to make that same mistake, would be fired.

Incredible, that's what they're taught through their whole careers, is to operate in that manner. Patel's been now in office for 14 months He clearly almost almost 14 months trying to hold on to this job. Why do you think he's still there?

It's interesting I think that he has a very close at times a very close relationship with the president and the president views the Justice Department as a means to go after his political, perceived political enemies and punish them either by harassment, you know, expensive legal suits, by firing them from jobs, believing that there are deep state people within the national security and the justice system.

So I think that Patel has been very willing to take those requests, those orders that come directly from the president, and use the resources of the FBI to direct them towards those kinds of personal projects of the president. And that's really, really important here, because you only have so many people, you only have so much time, and you have to decide, as the FBI director, are you pulling people away from following a terrorist? Are you pulling people away from monitoring

people who are abusing children? Are you pulling people away from other crimes that are really really significant and have massive harm? And I spoke to so many officials who said to me this is what I worry about at night. I cannot sleep at night because I'm worried that I may have pulled something away from somewhere and I've had to reorganize something and people may be harmed as a result. And so I think that was the really sobering thing that stuck with me throughout this reporting that I

would want every American watching to really think about because we are at a moment of unprecedented threats. That is not an overstatement. We have unprecedented threats and we only have we have to make sure that our resources are used accordingly.

Sarah Fitzpatrick, this is a really incredible story. Everybody should read it just to understand who's running our government right now. Thank you so much for hustling your way over here and helping really give us more meat on the bones of the piece.

Thank you again.

Thanks for having me. Breaking tonight, Trump Labor Secretary Lori Chavez-Duremer has resigned following a year tainted by scandal. At least two female staffers had accused the secretary's husband of sexual assault. There was an ongoing investigation into Chavez-Duremer's own conduct, where, among other issues, she was accused of having an affair with a security guard and drinking on the job. The Labor Department and White House had both denied those allegations.

But new tonight, Chavez-Durama was previously scheduled to be interviewed by the Labor Department inspector general about those allegations in the coming days. A source familiar with the matter tells MSNOW.

That timing, Michael, that is something.

That timing is something. And so let's clear the decks. This is a story, the headline that the Trump administration doesn't want to have to deal with along with all the other things they're dealing with, because it's the kind of distraction that Trump just doesn't want to have to answer to. I find it very interesting.

I also find this collage is sort of running. Let's just put this up. This is what they're dealing with in this department. You have New York Post, IG Probe Uncovers Labor Secretary Lori Chavez Deremer's office booze stash and strip club visit with subordinates. Even I never did that.

I just, you know, we only go that. Daily Beast, Trump's married labor boss accused of booze filled fleeing with staffer. The New Republic, Trump Labor Security The House accused of booze-filled fleeing with staffer. The new Republican Trump labor security caught using government funds for a birthday party. Secretary, husband and father sent personal texts to her young female staffers. What the hell is going on in this department?

And the fact that it's been allowed to happen for this long, I mean, any one of these headlines when they initially posted should have been enough. But it says a lot about this administration that it takes an accumulation of things. So it really, for me, is like, OK, why now? After, you know, the first one wasn't enough? What was the motivation?

Because of that IG probe.

Because of the IG probe.

Well, and it's unclear if she's still going to go in for that interview tomorrow and whether or not actually the OIG will complete it in its entirety now that she is leaving. But in case they don't, reporters have been on it. Let's actually read from The New York Times, who have been doing some incredible reporting on her conduct and the conduct of her family members. In one text message.

Chavez-DeRammer asked a staff member to bring Rosé to her hotel room. Do they sell by the bottle, she asked. The staff member responded that they did, but were out of Rosé. She responded with another selection. How about the Josh Savvy Bee? But we're getting a statement from her attorney who says that she didn't resign due to findings

that she violated the law. Her decision to leave the office was personal.

I keep thinking, Michael, about just the opportunity cost of having folks in these roles who are not laser-focused. Like, there is the behavior piece of this, right? And there is the part that is not befitting of the office. But there's also the fact that here you have an administration that came to power in part because they made an argument

to the American people about the economy and about affordability. You are running the labor department. You actually have access to one of the key agencies that would be tasked with tackling these issues. And it seems that you were focused on everything but.

Yeah, but that's the administration. I mean, they are everything everywhere all at once. No one's paying attention to any of it. And so you have these secretaries from Cash Patel and his sort of woo-woo at the Olympics. Why does he behave that way?

Because he feels he has license to behave that way. No other person in the job would behave that way? Because he feels he has license to behave that way. No other person in the job would behave that way in a very public setting like that. Why is the secretary making these types of requests? And why is her husband, you know, sort of prowling the staff? Because there is a license that's accepted to do that. You had the presidential candidate at one point in Donald Trump claiming what he could

do with women and didn't pay a political price for it. You know, you can feel you can grab people any way you want, come up on them however you want. Yeah, this is an attitude that's permissive. Everything happens from the top down.

The president of the United States, I don't know if you can figure this out, Donald, you set the tone. And so you reinforce that by the people you hire, number one, and then what you allow them to get away with for the time that they're allowed to get away with it. The fact remains, as you report, Jackie, this is happening now because the IG is stepping

in. But not according to Chavez-DeRammer, whose attorney released this statement. Secretary Chavez-DeRammer did not resign due to findings that she violated the law. Her decision to leave office was personal. It is notable to me, Jackie, though, that if you think about this administration and you think about who it is that has already been seen the door in that cabinet, can we just pull up that full screen really quickly? Pam Bondi, Kristi Noem,

that full screen really quickly? Pam Bondi, Kristi Noem,

Lori Chavez-Durhamer. Notice anything about those three have in common?