NU DIRUSAK, PULUHAN MILIAR KE KANTONG ELITNYA. VIA KONSESI TAMBANG, SKENARIO CANGGIH 2029 DIMULAI

I'm sure the conflict in the UN is because of mining. If there's a ghost or a kiai who denies that it's not because of mining, let's debate with me. I don't know if I'm affiliated to that, but when I asked, I heard that I'm affiliated to Boy Tohir.

Boy Tohir?

Yes.

For me, it's better to just return the mining. It will be very embarrassing for the UN if theU collapses just because of the behavior of these thieves. If I look at it, NU is indeed a design. The mining in NU is the design. It will be made into a machine at the same time independently through mining in 2029. For whose interest?

Maybe for Mr. Jokowi's interest. For them, this is not NU's money, anyway. This is a blessing from the previous president. NU is just a tool for passing by, actually.

So, it's really sophisticated. Sophisticated! We once raised this issue, presenting several religious organizations organizations when the ballot was taken by President Jokowi. I repeat, when the ballot was taken by President Jokowi. What I mean is the concession to religious organizations. The crowd apologized at that time.

We talked about it at that time. And at that time of all the fuss, I still tried to hold myself back. Because I wanted, like the character of this forum, the information was valid and could be answered. Of course I had to find someone who was qualified for that. I went around. Indilah.

People who understand it, apparently people who have been far from me. And I actually got it unintentionally. When I read, because I'm a Twitter user or ex now, I'm an active Twitter user. Why is the attitude of my friend different?

As a former journalist and someone who studies linguistics, I certainly understand the language of people who understand and the language of people who pretend to understand. Like this, the note in the ex. There is no conflict. It has only been continued by the millionaires. Until they have to break the division of the NU by betraying the Muqtamar security.

We understand that the point is the policy and politics of 2009. He will be the shield. Right? Then everything will appear. There is one more. political He is a Muslim. I've been looking for him for months. And I'm trying to... I'm a little bit worried.

Because I understand that this issue is very central. With an organization that has about 30-40 million people. Always on the social platform in the community. Even politics. I can understand, Gus, if you are so careful. But the first question is actually like this. Is this a joke or not? What is actually like this. Is this a NU or not?

What is it like, Ca?

Yes, thank you, Puang. My apologies. So, I have never been a NU manager. Starting from the ranting of MWCNU, PCNU, to PWNU, especially PBNU. Never. But I was destined to be born in the middle of a family of NU that is already rooted.

My grandfather is a shantri from Syahona Holil in Bangkalan. Syahona Holil is the teacher of Mbah Hashim Ash'ari, the founder of NU.

So NU is sometimes identical to Hubulwaton Minal Iman.

It is actually included in the book of Seyhona Holil which was later amplified by Mbah Hashim. And then became the spirit of NU until today. So my grandfather was the discipleantri of Shehonaholil, in the same line with Bahyai As'ad Samsul Arifin Sukorjo. And he is very NU. So, he is the backbone of NU.

And from my grandfather, my grandfather is a village Kiai, not a big Kiai. He is a farmer, he only had a farm. But he taught the books of the Vekih to the farmers as well. But in my grandfather's house, I still remember. Because I lived with my grandfather for decades.

He has a photo of Bung Karno, he has a photo of Pak Suharto. And the most interesting thing is that there is always a red and white flag at the door of his room. I love this country because of NU. I love the leader because of NU. I am tolerant because of NU. Because my grandfather taught me that.

So I then assumed that NU is the spirit of the country. The NU has never been a rebel in this country. And one thing that I learned from the NU and then became my lifestyle is NU teaches people to appreciate human. The second is to ask their people, to the people of the world, for egalitarianism. That's the most important.

And that's what then became I got to know egalitarianism, I got to know nationalism, I got to know tolerance and all that that because I am a NU. If I am not a Nahdien, I was destined to be born not to be a Nahdien, maybe I would have become a terrorist. So, if we talk about NU, we are talking about human civilization.

And that's what made me love NU so much. Why not just be a manager? One, for me, being a manager is a structural issue. For me, the NU is already value.

Oh, it's no longer in the structure?

It's no longer in the organizational and structural level. But for me, the NU is value. So I was asked many times, even in every conference, I was asked to be the manager of NU. But I realized that I'm not anyone, I'm not Kiai's son. Like my bio on Twitter, not Gus, but Kiai. So I realized that I'm just a street Nadine.

But, Alhamdulillah, I can still read books. I can still do basic Vakifakif. But, at least, NU gave me a lot of lessons. That I'm not too head-on and so on. I'm more egalitarian. I like to empathize with others, whatever their religion is, I got it from NU. I like NU's friends, I'm not sure if I'm NU or Muhammad, I'm not sure. Because NU's friends are everywhere.

But what I like about NU is that they are able to narrate the character of Indonesia in their minds. Whoever appears, Ghus Yahya appears, he is able to narrate, Pak Syed Akhil Sirat appears,

Islam Nusantara, Islam Nusantara, no more Ghus Durya.

Yes.

Then, yes, we have at least I get what is called an understanding that it is true that Gos Islam is a Hindu and it is worthy and it is measured if we talk about Hinduism. And until now I still go around, to the branches, to the MUC, which is a district. Ranting in my village is still around.

Is the MUC organization really solid?

Solid in terms of heroism, in terms of militancy, but solid, not solid in terms of financial problems. Because the MUC is not a place to make money.

Well, we go in there if that's the case. So, Gus, that was my opening,

that we once raised here.

Yes.

I or this forum regret that decision. But it has already happened. Who is this? Not a minister, not a DPR's leader, not a Parpo's leader anymore. But in the end I got a lot of information that you understand this problem. So I ask, please explain to us. Of course because we love you.

Yes, that's it. We start from there first. Actually what happened until then there were clashes, each other, or the like, internally, which at the level of the leaders. Yesterday, there was an interesting story, I don't know who, there was a story that the leaders were stopped in the middle of the road. There are many stories.

But the point is, they were stuck in a ditch. They fell there. So, what happened?

Please explain to us.

Thank you, Puang. Thank you, Mr. Mirza. So, actually, when Puang Akbar contacted me, why did he respond a bit late? Because I had to ask for permission from a few Kias to talk about this conflict.

Then, the second one,

I don't want to be considered as a member of one of the parties.

Because no matter what, I still want to make a change. Without Bahrawi.

That's it. A lot.

Especially since I just came back from England. The phone never stopped ringing. And I know they wanted to invite me to their camp. But, well, I'm just an ordinary person. But, here's the thing. I happen to understand a little. If you can say a little. I don't think I understand a little bit, but I understand a lot.

I'm starting to get excited. I understand a lot. I make sure that the conflict issues in the PBNU are because of mining issues. If there is Gus or Kiai who rejects that this is not because of mining, let's debate with me. Please debate, whether you want to be a kiai or a servant, I will face it. I am for kiai-kiai who are chasing money, who are only looking for gold in the body of the NU's PBN. I don't think it's a kiai anymore. I think he's a dark passenger in the NU.

He just wants to beat up the wrongdoers. That's my tweet. Because there are many things that I found out when I was asked by one of the managers of PBNU to do due diligence on this business proposal. This mining business proposal from one of the companies. I actually don't have a knowledge base about learning due diligence about the business proposal.

Let's just run through it first. That is, PBNU accepts IUPCA Special Investment Permit on the former KPC mining area, Kaltim, which is about 25,000 hectares.

Okay?

Yes. Then, the per place is number 70, which was created by Jokowi earlier. Then, when the NU accepted it, you were asked by the NU's PB manager to learn that. Yes. The due diligence. Yes.

I'm trying to connect the puzzles that I received. Where is the due diligence from? Company name is APN, PT APN. Here in my note, PT Anugrah Perdana Nusantara.

Yes, okay.

PT APN. Yes, and PT that is in NU2, which will be the partner of NU is PT Berkah Usaha Muamalah Nusantara, right? Okay, please continue. I'm telling this as an entry point when I'm involved.

I don't have any interest. But I, because I think who knows I can find something that is not beneficial for the NU. Because I really want to protect the NU. I don't want to protect the NU, because I'm not a member of the NU, but I just want to protect the NU. Then I learned, and there are many financial clauses that are not beneficial for the NU in my perspective.

Not at all. Like the burden of deposit fees to the ministries in SDM that must be borne by the NU. Then the Sarpras that must be borne by the NU. Access facilities, roads to mining locations, etc. It must be built. Even if heavy equipment is damaged,

it must be borne by the NU. Even though this is a management company that provides heavy equipment is damaged, it must be handled by the NU. Even though it is the management company that provides heavy equipment and so on. Why can't it be fair like this? The process is not my business, actually. I just found the clauses that make the NU more difficult. I don't want the NU to just just a platform, a bull, because NU is not an institution that has to make a profit.

But I understand that NU doesn't have money. Meanwhile, NU has to have big dreams, like building a university, a hospital, an education facility, and so on. Just like Muhammadiyah, who left the NU in terms of financial credibility, it's already extraordinary. NU, because the cultural people are farmers,

the Melarat people, the potato farmers in Buenos Aires, so, there are so many farmers in Malang, Lumajang, Jember, Tapal Kuda, and so on. These are ordinary people who cannot

give strength and financial contribution. So I understand, okay, as long as this has to protect the NU from loss, from loss or unfair behavior from mining managers, I will do it. What kind of agreement is that? That actually still involves a business proposal. I don't understand, Bang. Why is the business proposal so cruel at that time? Wait a minute. So that our audience can understand, Gus. So, the government, at that time it was the Jokowi government,

gave a mining concession to the NU. It means that this has NU. But because NU is not a mining company, it should be a partner. Then came the PT Anugrah Perdana Nusantara. More or less, maybe.

The process. Who owns this Anugrah Perdana? Who is affiliated with it? PT Anugrah Perdana Nusantara, which is recorded as the director there, is called Suhad. Suhad. to I'm just trying to identify myself. Because the logic has to be clear. So, it came.

Then, there was a proposal. That's what it sounds like. That the insurance in the bank... Deposit to ESDM. How big? 700 billion.

Wow, that's huge.

It's huge. Even the NU has built a campus, and it's not even finished yet. They built a hospital, and they have to work with Siloam and all that. It means that the NU doesn't have that much money. Why did the NU have to borrow money from the bank? This is not a...

These are all private institutions. Including building facilities?

Yes.

I don't understand.

Me neither. This is owned by the National Union of Indonesia. Why? And how much is the composition? About the composition, I actually forgot. Because there are so many pages.

And I'm still holding it. I'll check it later. But if I'm not mistaken, it's 70-30. 70 for the administrator and 30 for the BBN. But this must be cross-checked again. Including those who said they had Boy Tohir and all that, it was not confirmed. But when I heard it, indeed, the endorsement from Mr. Jokowi was also managed by Boy Tohir.

That's what I heard. And I don't know, maybe because of Mr. Jokowi's endorsement, Boy Tohir felt confident. No matter how difficult the clause is, no matter how unfair the clause is, he will definitely manage it. Maybe, more or less. Psychologically, I don't know. Maybe Mr. Boy or Mr. Suhad should come here.

Hopefully they want to.

They should want to.

Yes.

Okay.

Well, this is... Mr. Jokowi, how can we try to understand the logic of the story with the name of Mr. Jokowi earlier? Actually, this is how it is, Puang. This stamp was given by the President of the Republic of Mr. Jokowi. Actually, this is how it is, Puang. This stamp was given by the President of the Republic of Indonesia.

Not personally? Not personally, Mr. Jokowi. Because of the President. That's why I then asked the head of the Public Security Bureau, Gus Yahya, to come to the President of the Republic of Indonesia which is today is Mr. Prabowo

because it was given by the President, not by Mr. Jokowi so today when he will operate this mine he must first ask for a guide to the President of the Republic of Indonesia which is Mr. Prabowo, and it has been done. It has been done. I don't know exactly what the content of the conversation is. But indeed, the meeting was held by Mr. Yahya Stakouf with Mr. Prabowo after the results of the due diligence came out.

Maybe also due diligence from this business proposal was told to Mr. Prabowo, I don't know. But what is clear, for NU, I love NU, for me, it's not beneficial for NU, the proposal business. In my opinion, it's cruel.

If it sounds like what Jenengan said, it's not cruel, it's... What's the name again? It's called stepping on the foot in business. Yes. 70-30, then the facilities were built by the NU as the owner of the concession.

I even heard that the term of payment the profit from small to large in the following years what should we read in that situation? for me, in a simple way, and I have tweeted

here, this is a personal issue in the National Security Council that is trying to find a way through this hole the second, the National Security Council will be made a political machine in 2029. I don't know who is the most important, but the National Union of Nations is the most important.

Because it has mining, it has a large electoral mass, it has a strong political power based on religion, etc. This will be very sexy in 2029, especially since he has money through mining. So this will be an extraordinary political machine. So in my opinion, the second factor is that this will be used as a political leverage in 2029. That simple. That's why, I'm sorry, Wang, I'm being sarc it up so that viewers and friends can understand.

For me, it's better to just put it back. We'll get there. But... Because this has spread everywhere, right? Before we get to the battle that is said to be brought for the battle of 2029, I still focus first on the essence of the story. Why then, in the end, I still focus on the story. Why then, in the end, they just push each other?

What happened?

Because one another thinks that the other is a pillar. They are considered as a crumb in their shoes, in their big agenda. It must be like that. Especially people who have been allowed to be herejon are already tied to money and so on. So, in every way, with full militancy, they have to eliminate obstacles that block their intentions. Because if it's not like this, if this project doesn't happen to PTAPN, for example,

because PTAPN's money is recorded, it's been in the PBNU's account about 5 times since January 2024.

We have the record, take a look.

Wow, this is already got.

Okay.

Well, this is 6 billion. The language, the language of the RTGS is the employment guarantee of the coal mining. Okay. YUPKA PT BUMN. PT BUMN is the company of PBNU. From Sarana Karunia Perkasa Penjaring. SKPP. Whose company is this?

The same. This is definitely the company of Changkang too. I don't know. Then it was diverted. Diverted from SKPP. At the end of the transaction, it finally became APN, the National Bank of Indonesia. This 5th of February, it's also possible that it's from APN.

After that, it's from APN again. So maybe, the one that was going to be used was PT SKPP. But then, it changed. The one that transferred the money, the total amount

if I'm not mistaken, it's 40 billion, if we count it.

Well, that... This amount of money is 40 billion, if I'm not mistaken.

That is included in the BNU's account.

And the one who has access to the account is the general public.

What does this mean?

BNU has been tied up with 40 billion at the beginning.

With these companies.

So if BNU eventually turns out not to cooperate with this company, what will be exposed are people who make commitments of tens of billions of dollars. Who are those people? I don't know, but the ones who have access to this are definitely the public security.

In this case, the previous security, right?

Yes.

Who? Mr. Goodfunt, right?

Yes, Mr. Goodfan, for example. And if we want to see the configuration of today's fight in the PBNU, we can read it. Roi Isam with Sekjen. Sekjen with PBNU on one side. On this side alone is Yahya Holilstakuf. It means, this is already depicted like this. Who wants to throw who. The one who wants to be fired is actually Yahya Khalilzad Takuf at first. It means that maybe he is considered a stone of a shield.

Because maybe, as, maybe, my imagination, we are not that stupid, even though I'm on the road. Because maybe, because in PTBUMN, if we look at the notary's act, Gus Yahya is the main director.

As the general chairman, right?

Yes, and also the chairman of the cooperative. NU. It means that he really has the full power and authority to determine whether with this company or not with this company. Well, this is considered an obstacle. That's why it was rejected, maybe. My imagination is like that.

Then, if we look here, I honestly don't want to look at anyone in this matter. Well, for me there is no importance either. I just want to protect it. But then, this issue became more crucial, in my opinion, with Roi Is'am joining them, it became a big question mark. Joining them?

With the two parties who pushed it. And the one who became the motor in front this crushing process was Roi Isam. It was Kim Iftahul Ahyar who was promoted to them. Why? Because according to one of the other leaders, Roi Isam was the only one who could crush. If Bendum and Saikjen were Tanvid, it means he's under the general.

This is a big problem, because the score is 31.

That's what makes the situation more complicated, when the areas are also split. About mining, this is what makes me cry. I'm about to cry, Puang. It's true, Puang. I cried. At the beginning of this conflict, I was in Scotland.

I cried. I... I want to tell you a little bit about my sentiment. I'm actually... My father. My father passed away. I didn't cry. But when a big dream from this country is shattered just like that, because only a few of the ognum are in it,

especially the mining issue, money circulation, it will be very embarrassing for the NU if NU is shattered just because of the behavior of these smugglers. That's what hurts me. NU has been tested against the Dutch, tested against Masyumi when it broke, I'm crying because of this. That's what hurts me. The NU has been tested against the Dutch,

tested against Masyumi when he broke up, tested against the PKI and so on. Why do people's actions become a burden in this? Then the NU has to collapse just like that. This is what makes me not accept it. I cry between being touched and angry.

Yes, okay Gus. We are also, not only the NU, my management, we also really learn from this case. Once again, I agree with many views, many people that if there is anything with the N UN, then the nation will also have something. I believe that. Now, let's go back to our problem. What we are discussing here is, okay, there are graves that want to be demolished and there are graves that want to demolish. We have discussed earlier who is inside it But then I want to connect with what Mr. Isleh said earlier

That actually this political agenda is behind it Because this is a political forum, so I will go there We see how the door is the door of the company In this case, mining company Yes, the door is like that From the beginning, Gus Islam said that there was an effort and it turned out to have happened.

This company must get this concession. Under the name of INU. In this case, PT Anugrah, the chairman of Nusantari. Which you call, affiliated with Mr. Boy.

Yes.

Yes, the person I know. But it turned out that it wasn't that easy. What is it called? The problem is, because like you have the document, it damages the NU. Yes. Then there was a fight.

The problem is, there was money that we showed earlier. There was already someone who was flowing. Yes. the from the beginning, it seems like someone planned it so that it would be in the hands of that person. Even in the press, the press said that the old owner shouldn't be there. And the old owner is Bakri Group. KPC. Yes, I've been there.

I went to KPC. The content was good. It was tasty. Yes. KPC? Yes, I've been there. I went to KPC. It was a good place.

Yes.

It was tasty.

Yes.

He said yes. I don't know. I don't know about the rice.

It's the same.

He said it was all meat. He said it was all meat. The price was around tens of trillions. Is that the story? Yes, more or less like that. So I don't know about this Sandra Menyandra, but Puang, if we talk about mining, we talk about money, the flow of the general public of the BNU at that time. There was no conflict yet. It was far away. At the beginning of this year.

I said, why does PTAPN dare to send money to these accounts? Because I already have this data, maybe long before the money, I've had this data for a long time.

Why does PTAPN dare to embezzle money up to 40 billion? If I'm not mistaken. We used to be united. That's the language. But it turns out, in various actions,

suddenly there was a report of 3.5 billion for mining business development, including nickel. At that time, I said, I know the mining, but it's just coal, why is there nickel and everything? That's what made me think, why is this getting everywhere? Well, that's what made me think,

apparently, many people in this mine who are looking for a job, looking for personal benefits. I told Kya Yahya at that time, to Gus Yahya, if Gus Yahya wants to defend NU and wants to empower NU from this mine, okay, we support. I said that to Gus Yahya when I first met him after this mining. But if there are still personnel who want to make a profit in this mining in NU, we will never get involved in it. I don't want to get involved at all and I don't want to...

I was very strong at one podcast, Buang. I rejected mining. Because I was worried that later there would be people who make money in NU but use Sorban. I said that. It refuse mining. Because I'm worried that later there will be people who are looking for money in NU but use a bank. I've said that, it's still there. And it turned out to be. And it turned out to be. But because at that time I said I wanted this mine to be really for NU. There should be no personal interest in looking for money from this mine. If the total share is 50-50, 50-60-40,

it must be registered in the National Union of Miners and can be accounted for. More or less like that. At that time, I think it was still in line with today's head-to-head with some people. Yes, I said, okay, we agree. Please manage the NU mining, because the obstacle of NU's struggle from the past, if we have the gear, we have the militancy,

what we don't have is the accommodation, the logistics that we don't have. So we understand, NU campuses, Natatul in various areas have been completely destroyed. It has never progressed because there is no funding acceleration. This is what I realized. Okay, NU must have a mining company.

But there is no politicization, nothing to empower NU. We agree at that time. So, I finally want to do that due diligence and control this process to ensure that the NU is benefited, not the personnel in the NU. It's not simple, Gos, right now.

Because I hear the state palaces are starting to be taken over here. There are high-ranking officials, officials of the state, at the same level as the minister, suddenly involved or involved, or involved, it's unclear to me. And then it became a story at the elite level.

That there is another agenda. There is a political agenda. So, it's true what everyone says. The mining issue in the NU is amazing everywhere. What's the story like, Gus? Every candidate, the NU is throw a section. But after the candidates, it's just a conflict.

It's an extraordinary battle. Every five years, there's a zero-sum game in the NU. I believe that the NU, with this mining, will become more and more fragile, more and more vulnerable more dangerous because the NU will have money

with extraordinary electoral influence I corrected earlier, Puang said 30-40 actually the NU members recorded administratively is 120 million

120 million?

the largest in the world, religious organization

directly beat the voters?

directly beat the voters if it turns out that all the people of Nadien can be influenced by this mining, then this will be interesting for 2029. I have a great confidence that there is a role of Mr. Jokowi from the beginning here, who then drives this management trajectory to Boy Tohir, for example. If this is really Boy Tohir behind this, behind PTAPN, I think it has special agendas.

Especially if you look at the composition of the share of profits that was mentioned by Puang earlier, it was small at first, the higher it was at the bottom, er, at the end. What does that mean? There is a kind of trajectory that was deliberately made when in 2029, the NU had a lot of money. So the political accommodation and logistics of the NU in 2029 can be...

It's already fulfilled.

It's already fulfilled. It doesn't need to be injected from the outside. All this time, the NU has been political. The NU people are made as an electoral machine, it's injected from the outside. But this is not.

It has been prepared from the outside. But this one is not.

It's been prepared from the beginning. It's been prepared from the beginning and we know who prepared it. This IUPCA was issued during Mr. Jokowi's era. It means that if the design is like that, how do we say it, we are in a hurry or trying to pretend not to be a bad guy, it's a hassle. But if I look at it, the design of the mining industry in the NU is that it will be made into an independent machine through mining in 2029. For whose interest? Maybe for Mr. Jokowi's interest. In what way?

Mr. Jokowi is no longer president. Except for his son, perhaps. Well, that's the answer.

Is that so?

Well, we both use our analysis in politics. Because, one, it was made to the press, the old president. The old president cannot join this mining management. What is the basis of the idea? There is none. Indeed, if the old owners join the management of cooperation with the National Union of Miners, it is not much better.

Because the old owners should know more. What is the content? What is the value? Where is the meat is, where the bone is, because the one who understands it better should be the KPJ, right? But this was blocked by Mr. Jokowi by the press that the applicant cannot participate in mining management with the NU. Likewise in Mohammadiya and in other organizations. And the long-term candidate is Bakri. Bakri.

On the other hand, there is a kind of endorsement with other people. This is already a kind of corridor, a labyrinth that has been prepared. You don't go left. If you go left, you will meet gangbuntu.

You go right. In the end, it's Mr. Jokowi's choice too. That's how simple it is to think. If you go left, you will meet gangbuntu, if you go right, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangbuntu, you will meet gangb There are some personnel who are trying to gain personal benefits by raising the bar for the PBNU. This is another story. If it's about politics, maybe that's the grand design. But about this conflict, we can't deny it, we can't lie that there are some personnel in the PBNU who want to find personal benefits through mining. But it's so clear, the trajectory is like this, Gus. That, okay, you tried to make the analysis earlier that this is only people in internal.

But it's already very visible, right? That the trajectory has been arranged very well. People who understand a little bit of intelligence can read it like this. And even if we look at the composition of the distribution of benefits, why it's small at first, I'm sure Yahya Khalil Stakhoof as the head of the PBNU, it's already planned, it won't be chosen again in the next session.

I'm sure of that. We all, especially friends who have intelligence analysis skills, we can all be the elicitin. We can be the emergence. Well, later, in 2029, the general chairman will be their chosen one. And they will be allowed to use the NU as a political burden, along with their money.

For them, this is not the NU's money, no matter what. This is a blessing from the previous president. The NU is just a tool for passing by. That's it.

So sophisticated.

So sophisticated.

So sophisticated.

I never thought about it. When I was analyzing this for days, I was crying. The NU has always been like that. In the new order, in the Gusdur era, they were always being manipulated.

They were always being suspected. Gusdur was made the leader of Abu Hassan's campaign Mu'tamarji Pasung Gus Dur was threatened by the army and so on The NU is the main pillar in this country But the NU has always been like that from time to time

And these are the people in the BNU who are trying to find their own benefits, their own food, for their own stomach's own interest, they never think historically and the aspirations of their founders.

That's what makes me so angry with those tweets. At the same time, there were also some notes that, without much explanation, you should explain to us too. For example, that Yahya Stakhov is a Zionist.

By inviting someone who is a bully, but it turns out to be a Muslim. The second one is that there is hundreds of billions of money from, who is his name, former PBNU ambassador as well. Maming. Maming. What's his name, the regent of Sumatra Southern University, actually.

And all kinds of that. Which one is the right one, Gus? I will be suspected later that you are a liar. I honestly don't know about the Maming issue. I'm just a passerby. Who am I?

Maybe the elite NU players don't know me. I'm just an ordinary person. But, about Charles Holland Taylor, who became a professional. He is a bule. A bule, a mu'alaf, his name is Muhammad Khalil. Well, he's not Gus Yahya who brought it, actually. Gus Dur brought it. And it turns out he's friends with everyone in NU, right?

Including Buya Shafi'i Imarif, Gusmus. It means that these people are the ones who make the engagement between the NU and the international institutions. Including the ones who are looking for funds for the NU. In the past, the NU never asked for government's help. For Muqtamar, it was the villagers who gave, hoped for the Barokah to be prosperous, were the villagers who paid the farmers. Because the government did give the NU a lot of money at that time.

So, to cover the shortage of NU's budget, many got donations from foreign philanthropy. The path is Charles Holland Taylor. From the Ghost Door era. And even Buya Shafi'i Imarif from Muhammadiyah is close to Charles Holland Taylor.

It means that this is not a new thing, but it's a waste. This Zionist accusation. This is not a new thing. It's the same as Suharto who wants to confront his enemy with a communist accusation. It's the same.

Do we remember? President Sudarmano, by Suharto, was made a topic that he was a descendant of a communist from Cerme, from Gersik. Because he had a conflict with Mr. Sudarmano, his own representative. It means that if today it is done by the people of the UN, well, this is not a new thing anymore. Today, the best trade to give bad stigma to others is Zionism.

Because Israel is not popular anymore. I think, if that's the problem,

I'm not defaming Gus Yahya, I'm not defending Gus Yahya. Because, in fact, Charles Holland Taylor, since Gus Dur's time, has been a member of the PBNU. I know that. And I think Saiful Ayusuf also knows. Because Saiful is my friend of mine, Saiful Ayusuf is a friend of my college in UNAS. So, we have known each other for a long time. And we know Charles Holland Taylor, if there are seminars at PBNU, Charles Holland Taylor also appeared at the time of Gus Durit. Yes, I mentioned this because later people will ask, why this forum doesn't discuss that?

That's why we're here. But again, I'm still thinking about the first part. So, NU is going to be well-designed, even the time frame has been arranged, in 2027, there will be, what is it called, in December 2026 there will be a main event,

who are the people who have been prepared, all kinds of things, it turns out that at the end there is 2029. If that's the case, it's normal if you're worried that the NU could be involved in something like this.

It could be pinched. And even like this, Puang, why is the timeline really pushed by Roi Isam to immediately accelerate the new chairman election and show the PLT, Mr. Zulfa? Because this is connected to the mining management timeline too. timeline pengelolaan tambang juga. Tambang ini harus selesai bulan Desember ini, tahun ini.

Tinggal berapa hari?

Ya, tinggal 15. Dan itu sudah benar, sudah terjadi? Ya belum kan, belum terjadi kontrak, belum masih konflik seperti ini, otomatis timeline itu pasti akan tidak bisa dipenuhi. Tunggu dulu, tunggu dulu. Berarti ini belum ada kontrak? Belum di tanah tangani? Belum, Mas. is want to work with PT APN,

they have signed it, before the money comes in, there is already a signature. But then there is a business proposal like that. Which is not fair. Why a signature if it turns out that it is not in agreement with the business proposal? It's not a cooperation agreement, maybe.

Maybe, maybe. Maybe a kind of MOU? Yes, a kind of pre-commitment. Yes, pre-commitment. So maybe that's the process. But then it changed in the past because it could be

Yahya Holilstakuf kissed a cockroach that was uncomfortable and so on and so on. Or maybe also because of the clauses that make the PBNU heavier. Maybe too. Now, what is the fate of the mining concession itself in the hands of the Ministry of Energy? As far as I know, there is not a single mining contractor

that has made MOU with PTBUMN. I heard there are parties that are willing to reverse the situation. So, it's not 70-30, 70 PT, 30 NU, this is reversed. 70 NU and all kinds of things are built by the company itself. Why don't you choose that? I don't know what it's called, but I heard it.

Well, I also heard that. But I'm sure maybe because of the conflict in the PBNU that is so tense, so the process may not be possible. I believe that. The delay happened because the conflict has been exploding. More or less like that.

And added to the increasingly tight timeline, where this December there must be a commitment time for PBNU and the regulators to make a commitment This is a time that cannot be delayed It means that if it can't be fulfilled this month Everything will restart from zero So, automatically, this will become a rush hour

So, we have to fight against time. What I imagine now is this, Ghusli Slah, while listening to the various information, I imagine there is a way out, there is a door. to Sandra, Sandra, this is... Sandra, because there was money there.

Yes.

I even heard there was a video that still has the recording. How, what is it called, the person involved in this... Don't say it's a liar, it's a criminal. You know everything. That he, what is it called, got that. I have to not mention his name because I can't put it here.

But if I have it now, I can. If that's the case, the story can't be found, then the conflict will continue to develop. Yes. I'm sure, Puang, what I suggested earlier, rather than the NU continue to be like this, it's better to do reconciliation.

How?

Reconciliation, and then meet the two sides that are fighting with a note, all of that is done the concessionary loan is returned to the country Returned to the country? Returned to the country but there must be some who don't want

especially those who have who have the green money at the beginning. Of course, because he is burdened with debt. Unless he wants to be a preman too. A preman with a priest. Or the one who gave the money said it was not a problem. Unless he has a lot of money.

But if I have already spent 40-70 billion, for example, to others, but it turns out to be canceled on the side, if I want to be angry, I ... Especially if you imagine, it turns out that the land of the concession is full of meat.

Wow, this is bad, right?

Yes, yes, that's right. So, for me, from what happened at the PBNU, after I knew a lot of things, something that happened behind the scenes and various people when I came, I finally tried to do an investigation. I met a lot of people, the conclusions that were then involved in this mining business, I came one by one and told a lot of stories I was then taught that I no longer want to believe 100% in those false rumors. That's my principle, Puang. I can be good, have good intentions, but I have to leave at least 15% of the residuals for bad intentions.

I have to leave Sudan in my head, because it turns out that all the evil that is done with the religion will try to be respected. This is what happened in the PBNU. The mining problem is a bunch of money, a bunch of money, tens of billions of money, which is held by a handful of people. It is a fight for an organization founded by scholars, scholars, worshippers, and so on, for the welfare of the people, but suddenly it is surrounded only to be a dark passenger.

This is what makes me cry, Puang. I was suddenly surrounded by darkness This is what makes me cry, Puang I'm really crying because for me, NU

Please, NU people, leave NU Let me die alone in NU

That's me

Gus

I don't want to... Sorry.

I don't want to continue this discussion, but I think we should end this story. I'm sorry, Wang. I have a lot of material that I can give. But if I give it today, I'm afraid it will make this conflict even more tense. That's what I'm saying.

I will open all the time later. Let's pray, Gus. Friends in the UN can get through this phase. Although, to be honest, with all the situations I've been through, I haven't been able to meet you. Because the level is already far. It's crushing.

And there's money, but not a small amount. The person is clear, the one who receives. The one who gives clearly. a do it. One yet the other. Or any jealous young men are in my young American jealous

digital

and

this because he said the and the your willingness to explain this very crucial thing. I'm sorry if it turns out that he mentioned 30-40 million, but it turns out to be 120 million.

Administratively.

And if there is someone who benefits from it, he is the winner.

That's right.

We have mentioned the person earlier. Once again, thank you Gus.

Thank you. The viewers, first I have to be very careful. So, on one side, I'm trying to chase, but on the other side, I have to be careful. Why? This involves an organization that is extraordinarily large, extraordinarily large.

There are many big names that have been run there. People I respect very much. But shouldn't we manage this nation in a more measured way? One of them is by discussing it. So that if there is a mistake, it will not happen in the future. While waiting for you at the BNU to solve this problem,

we must continue to talk. Thank you for watching this interview. How do you solve this problem? We have to keep talking. we must continue to talk. Thank you for watching this interview. How do you solve this problem? We have to keep talking. Thank you for watching!