Rubio says "both sides are going to have to make concessions" to end war in Ukraine

Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky and other European leaders following Mr. Trump's meeting with Vladimir Putin. Turn over the lands seized by Russia in the war, plus additional territory. We begin with Secretary of State Marco Rubio, who attended those talks in Anchorage. Good morning to you, Mr. Secretary.

Good morning. Thank you.

Vladimir Putin did not give President Trump the ceasefire he sought, and now Putin says the root causes of the conflict have to be resolved in a peace agreement. Isn't the root cause the fact that Russia invaded in the first place?

Well, ultimately, yeah. But I mean, what he means by root causes is his long historical complaints that we've heard repeatedly. This is not a new argument. He's been making this for a long time. And it's the arguments on all of that stuff.

We're going to focus on this. Are they going to stop fighting or not, and what it's going to take to stop the fighting? And what it's going to take to stop the fighting's very difficult because Ukraine obviously feels, you know, harmed and rightfully so because they were invaded, and the Russian side because they feel like they've got momentum in the battlefield and frankly don't care, don't seem to care very much about how many Russian soldiers die in this endeavor.

They just churn through it. So I think what the president deserves a lot of credit for is the amount of time and energy that his administration is placing on reaching a peace agreement for a war that's not a war that started under him. It's half – you know, it's on the other side of the world. That said, I mean, it's relevant to us. But there are a lot of other issues he could be focused on. So tomorrow we'll be meeting with President Zelensky. We'll be meeting with European leaders. We just met with Putin. He's dedicated a lot because he has made it a priority of his administration to stop wars or prevent them. And right now, this is the biggest war going on

in the world, it's the biggest war in Europe since World War II. We're gonna continue to do that.

And leaders, what was discussed was Putin demanding control of Donetsk, a region in the east that his forces do not fully hold, and the UK estimates that taking that full area could be as long as another four years. Putin also is demanding Russian be an official language in Ukraine and something regarding

Russian Orthodox Church. Of what Putin laid out at that table?

Well, the president said he did come to some agreements. It's up to the Ukrainians to make these conditions. Well, the agreements were that we were going to try to do things like, for example, get a leader, a leaders meeting. We have to make enough progress so that we can sit down President Zelensky and President Putin in the same place, which is what President Zelensky has been asking for, and reach a

final agreement that ends this war. Now, there were some concepts and ideas discussed that we know the Ukrainians could be very supportive of in that meeting. I don't think it's we're not going to negotiate this in the media I understand that everybody wants to know what happened But ultimately there are things that were discussed as part of this meeting that are potentials for breakthroughs that are potentials for progress We'll be discussing that more in depth tomorrow with our European allies with the Ukrainians that are coming over We'll be discussing all of these things because ultimately we do need to find areas where we're making progress and try to begin to you

Know narrow the gap between the two sides. But there's a reason why this war has been going on for three and a half years, and that is when it comes to the big issues here, there are still some big differences between both sides. Let's see how much progress we can continue to make. It's not been easy, but it's something the president's made a priority, peace, and he deserves a lot of credit for that. But ultimately, if Vladimir Putin

is going to be offered land that he has not seized yet, but negotiates his way into, doesn't this set a dangerous precedent that the United States now accepts this concept that it is OK to seize land by force?

Well, Putin's already seized land by force. And that in and of itself is not a positive precedent. This whole war is a negative precedent. Are you demanding a withdrawal? Well, again, in order to have a deal here, in order to reach the end of this conflict, both sides are going to have to make concessions. But does that mean accepting where Russian forces are now?

No, no, but this is not about accepting. This is about what Ukraine can accept and what Russia can accept. They both have to accept it. Otherwise there won't be a peace deal. If there aren't concessions, if one side gets everything they want, that's called surrender. That's called the end of the war through surrender.

And that's not what we're close to doing because neither side here is on the verge of surrender or anything close to it. So in order for there to be a peace deal, this is just a fact, we may not like it, it may not be pleasant, it may be distasteful, but in order for there to be an end of the war, there are things Russia wants that it cannot get, and there are things Ukraine wants

that it's not going to get. Both sides are gonna have to give up something in order to get to the table, in order to make this happen. That's just the way it is. And I mean, the sooner we accept that, that's the reality. Now, what those things are is going to be up to both sides. There's no conditions that can be imposed on Ukraine. They're going to have to accept things, but they're going to have to get things, too. And so, for example, Ukraine is a sovereign country.

They have a right, like every sovereign country does in the future, to prevent threats to the national security. That's not an unreasonable request. That's something that needs to be worked on. Territories will have to be discussed. It's just a fact. And there are things that maybe Russia is holding now that they're going to have to

give up. Who knows? The point is, we need to create a scenario where that becomes possible. been so hard because neither side up to now has been willing to give on some of these things. But we'll see if that's possible. It may not be, but we're going to try and we're going to do everything we can to try

to achieve a peace.

I understand you can't get into specifics in a public conversation, but we're looking at Russian troops and strikes intensifying. Did you hear anything from Vladimir Putin that indicated he is willing to make a single concession?

Well, I think there are a couple of things. I mean, not enough for Ukraine. If not, we would be announcing a peace deal this morning, right? But certainly there are some things we noticed changes. There are some changes that I think are possible. I think there's some concepts that were discussed that could potentially lead to something.

But again, all these things have to be verifiable. It isn't real until it's real. I mean, one thing is what you say you might be willing to consider, another thing is your willingness to do it, and it always becomes a trade-off in all of this.

But you talk about the intensifying strikes on the Russian side, yeah. I mean, they're a full-time war machine. I mean, that's a big country. It's not just large geographically. It has huge populations.

It continues to churn through people. You know, they lost 20,000 Russian soldiers were killed last month in July in this war. That just tells you the price they're willing to pay. Not saying any of this is admirable. I'm saying that this is the reality of the war that we're facing. It's become attrition in some ways. It's a meat grinder, and they just have more meat to grind.

Let me ask you about the security that you just mentioned there. Because Italy's prime minister says that President Trump revived the idea of security guarantees inspired by NATO's Article 5 and a collective security clause that would involve the United States. How does that work? Are these US troops?

Are these US monitors?

Well, that's what we're going to be working on. That's one of the reasons why I talked yesterday to all the national security advisors, a bunch of them from the different European countries. There are European leaders coming here tomorrow, heads of state coming tomorrow, along with President Zelensky,

to discuss this in more detail. I mean, the constructs of something like this needs to be built out. It's a concept is one thing. The reality — you know, how it's built and how it would work is another. But those are the kinds of talks that we're going to be having with them, along with some of the other issues that are at play. I mean there are obviously there needs to be an agreement on territories and where the lines are going to be drawn That's not going to be very easy. That's going to be tough

I think there has to be some discussion about security guarantees for Ukraine Because they don't want this war to none of us want to see this war in the future. They're a sovereign country They have a right to have security agreements with other countries and security alliances with other countries And then there's the whole issue of construction. How do you rebuild the country? Well potentially like I said, that's what we're going to be having a conversation about. And that's what we're going to be meeting. That's why they're all coming here tomorrow.

And that's why we've been talking on the phone for the last 48 hours with them and even leading up to it throughout the week. There were various meetings just to sort of build out some of All of these right now are ideas or concepts that require some more specificity. We'll need to work with our partners to see what that looks like. And I think that's an area where potential progress is real, but that alone won't be enough. There's a bunch of other things that have to be worked through here.

Yeah, well, Russia claims it has rescued 700,000 children. I know you know that the warrant out for Vladimir Putin's arrest is for the state-sponsored abduction of kids. I've seen estimates there are something like 30,000 Ukrainian children who have been abducted. Is the United States demanding, or at least even just as a statement of goodwill here, that Russia return these children?

Yeah, I mean, we've repeatedly raised that issue on every forum possible. And those have also been, by the way, topics of discussion not just in our meetings with the Ukrainians, but in the negotiations and talks that were going on between Ukraine and Russia at the technical level. These talks were going on in Turkey, as an example. Turkey over the last few months.

NANCY CORDES, The New York Times Journalist and Politico Reporter.

Yeah, nothing so far from the Russians. That's been a topic of discussion as well. should be returned to their families. On that position, I don't think there's any ambiguity on our side. And they shouldn't even be, you know, a bargaining chip in regards to a broader negotiation. But it's just one more element of how tragic this war is. After three and a half years, this war is getting worse. It's not getting better. You've made the point about the uptick in strikes. This is a much time in bringing this to an end. And by the way, everyone is begging us to be involved in this. The Europeans want us involved. The Ukrainians want us involved.

Obviously, the Russians want us involved, because the president is the only leader in the world. If this is possible, he's the only one that can help make it happen.

Well, he's got the leverage over Vladimir Putin if he wanted to crush his economy or at least do more damage to it. But you have held off on those secondary sanctions. President Trump told Fox News his advice to President Zelensky is make a deal. Russia's a very big power, and they're not. You know there is concern from the Europeans that President Zelensky is going to be bullied into signing something away.

That's why you have these European leaders coming as backup tomorrow. Can you reassure them? into signing something away. That's why you have these European leaders coming as backup tomorrow.

Can you reassure them? No, it isn't. That's not why they're coming as backup. That's not true. No, but that's not true. They're not coming here tomorrow to keep Zelensky from being bullied.

They're not coming. In fact, they're coming here tomorrow

because of television cameras, where President Zelensky was dressed down. You've had since then? Oh, no, I know. And I was just up in Alaska watching the one with Vladimir Putin where red carpet rules

rolled out for the Russian leader.

No, but with Zelensky.

We've had more meetings. We've had one meeting with Putin and like a dozen meetings with Zelensky. But that's not true. They're not coming here tomorrow to keep Zelensky from being bullied. They're coming here tomorrow because we've been working with the Europeans. to them last week. There were meetings in the UK over the previous weekend. And they said President Trump was going to demand a ceasefire. As early as Thursday.

But you said that they're coming here tomorrow to keep Zelensky for being bullied. They're not coming here tomorrow. This is such a stupid media narrative that they're coming here tomorrow because Trump is going to bully Zelensky into a bad deal. We've been working with these people for weeks, for weeks on this stuff. They're coming here tomorrow because they chose to come here tomorrow. We invited them to come. We invited them to come.

The president invited them to come.

But the president told those European leaders last week that he wanted a ceasefire. The president went on television, said he would walk out of the meeting if Vladimir Putin didn't agree with one. He said there would be severe consequences if he didn't agree to one. He said he'd walk out in two minutes. He spent three hours talking to Vladimir Putin and he did not get one.

So there's some mixed messages. Because obviously something, things happened during that meeting. Well, because obviously things, look, our goal here is not to stage some production for the world to say, oh, how dramatic, he walked out. Our goal here is to have a peace agreement to end this war. OK. Okay, and obviously we felt and I agreed that there was enough progress not a lot of progress But enough progress made in those talks to allow us to move to the next phase

If not, we wouldn't be having Zelensky flying all the way over here We wouldn't be having all the Europeans coming all the way over here now understand and take with a grain of salt I'm not saying we're on the verge of a peace deal But I am saying that we saw movement enough movement to justify a follow-up meeting with Zelensky and the Europeans, enough movement for us to dedicate even more time to this. You talk about the sanctions. Look, at the end of the day, if peace is not going to be possible here, and this is just going to continue on as a war, people will continue to die by the

thousands. The president has that option to then come in and impose new sanctions. But if he did this now, the moment the president puts those additional sanctions, that's the end of the talks. You have basically locked in at least another year to year-and-a-half of war and death and destruction. We may unfortunately wind up there, but we don't want to wind up there. We want to wind up with a peace deal that ends this war, so Ukraine can go on with the rest of their lives and rebuild their country and be assured that this is never going to

happen again. That's the goal here. We're gonna do everything possible to make that happen if it's doable. It will require both sides to make concessions. It will require both sides to get things they're asking for. That's how these deals are made, whether we like it or not.

Before I let you go, quickly, why did the State Department just announce that they're halting visitor visas for all Gossens coming here for medical aid. Why would some of these kids, for example, who are coming to hospitals for treatment be a threat?

Well, first of all, it's not just kids. It's a bunch of adults that are accompanying them. Second, we had outreach from multiple congressional offices asking questions about it. And so we're going to reevaluate how those visas are being granted, not just to the children,

but how those visas are being granted to the people who are accompanying them. And by the way, to some of the organizations that are facilitating it, there is evidence been presented to us by numerous congressional offices that some of the organizations bragging about and involved in acquiring these visas have strong links to terrorist groups like Hamas. And so we are not going to be in partnership with groups that are friendly with Hamas. So we need to, we we're gonna pause those visas. There was just a small number of them issued to children,

but they come with adults accompanying them, obviously, and we are going to pause this program and reevaluate how those visas are being vetted and what relationship, if any, has there been by these organizations to the process of acquiring those visas.

We're not gonna be in partnership with groups that have links or sympathies towards Hamas. Secretary of State Marco Rubio, we have to leave it that have links or sympathies towards Hamas. Secretary of State Marco Rubio, we have to leave it

there for this morning. Thank you for joining us. Thank you.