Stephen A. calls for WNBA Commissioner Cathy Engelbert to RESIGN | First Take

Let's move on to some WNBA. Nafisa Collier and the Lynx season may be over, but she took her final opportunity to speak to the media. She used that opportunity to air some grievances about the league and the WNBA's commissioner,

Kathy Engelbert. Players are currently battling to negotiate a new collective bargaining agreement, and Collier is the vice president of the WNBA Players Association. Here's what she had to say about a private conversation she had with the commissioner.

At Unrivaled this past February, I sat across from Kathy and asked how she planned to address the officiating issues in our league. Her response was, well only the losers complain about the refs. I also asked how she planned to fix the fact

that players like Kaitlin, Angel, and Paige, who are clearly driving massive revenue for the league, are making so little for their first four years. Her response was, Kaitlyn should be grateful she makes 60 million off the court because without the platform that the WNBA gives her, she wouldn't make anything. And in that same conversation, she told me, players should be on their knees thanking their lucky stars for the media rights deal that I got them. That's

a mentality driving our league from the top. We have the best players in the world. We have the best fans in the world. But right now we have the worst leadership in the world.

Commissioner Engelbert released the following statement in response to that. Quote, I have the utmost respect for Nafisa Kalir and for all the players in WNBA. Together we have all worked tirelessly to transform this league. My focus remains on ensuring a bright future for the players in WNBA,

including collaborating on how we continue to elevate the game. I am disheartened by how Nafisa characterized our conversations and league leadership, but even when our perspectives differ, my commitment to the players and to this work will not waver. Monica McNutt is here to help us break this down. Monica, what do you think of Collier's comments?

Oh, man. Good morning, gentlemen.

Good morning, Monica.

I think it's important to note who Nafisa Collier is, right? We're talking about a runner-up to the MVP multiple times in her career. We're talking about a runner-up to the MVP multiple times in her career. We're talking about one of the more measured players in the league is not someone who flies off the handle emotionally.

When she sat down, that was a written statement. And so I think, to me, I can't help but look ahead to the end of October, gentlemen, in which the current collective bargaining agreement will end for the WNBA, and it seems that these sides are woefully far apart across the league. In terms of responses from players,

there has been no one that hesitated to back Fee and stand alongside of her as players because she is that trusted and regarded, that she would not come to the conversation ill-prepared in terms of really setting this thing off and bringing attention to the fact

that these players are not going to back down. And listen, the potential media rights deal or the media rights deal, I should say, is fantastic. But as we saw back during all-star break for the WNBA, if you're only getting a minimal percentage, then that is why the players wore those shirts that said, pay the players. And so while the rights deal is important, it is also important that it trickle down to the players who make this league that has been so appealing

that folks want to be a part of it.

I appreciate that, Monica. I don't disagree with anything that you said. I just want to add to it. Kathy Engelbert, the commissioner of the WNBA. Keep Monica up on the screen, please, because I want to see her. Kathy Inglebrook, the commissioner of the league.

Doggie, Peter, Monica, let me say for the record, you should resign. You need to resign, period. The reason I say that, Doggie, is because when a player, any player, but especially one of that magnitude, attacks you publicly like that, that weak-ass statement Commissioner Engelberg gave

is not good enough. And I'm going to say it, it was a weak-ass statement. Could you imagine somebody directing comments and criticisms at you, taking conversations they've had with you directly and telling the world what you said? And did you see that statement Commissioner Engelberg gave? If that, I mean, you, she basically provided no defense of herself I mean, I don't have the statement right directly in front of me y'all and she's characterization. You get a

Mischaracterization this heart. I'm disheartened that the mischaracterization what what? That was a I don't I'm not saying she person the feature collar personally attacked the like personally I'm not trying to personalize it like that, but I'm just saying she personally, Nafisha Khalid personally attacked her, like personally, I'm not trying to personalize it like that, but I'm just saying her words were piercing. That was an attack against your leadership. It was an attack against your integrity.

It was an attack against your character, against your character. And that's the statement you came out with. Listen, I've reached out to Kathy Engelbert's office. I said you are welcome to come on my show today and explain because I want to know how the hell somebody says something like that

about you as the Commissioner. Doggy, come on man. I mean whether it was David Stern or Adam Silver or Roger Goodell or Paul Tagliabue, or Pete Rose. Could you imagine, imagine a commissioner being called out like that directly? And that timid, tepid statement, oh, she looks guilty as hell. And then I'm looking at it, I'm saying, did you really say that? Did you really say that Kaitlyn Clark should thank her Heavenly Stars,

that she wouldn't be worth anything if she wasn't playing in the WNBA? Did you really see all of these things that Nafisha Khalia brought up? I'm sitting back going like this girl You got my ears perked. I'm like I got I'm listening because she got very very specific and for her to come to Commissioner to come back with that. You can't have her at the negotiating table talking to players Basically the future console says she's in the way of our growth and our development as a league not just on the player side

But on the league side she's not good for basketball That's what the feature got nobody questioned the Kathy Engelbert's business acumen now, because we know she knows business. And you see the average player salaries. It was $28,000 when they first started. It's about over $130,000 now. You've got salaries over $200,000 now, some of them.

But that's not enough. At the end of the day, you have a star player in the league saying, the commissioner, this individual, is in the way of all of us. And that was her statement. I believe she should hand in her resignation. And I don't follow this as carefully,

but I watched it today. That was a tremendous non-call on the play that Kier lost the ball and lost the game.

Okay?

That was a great job by the officials. We agree. That was not a job by the officials. We agree.

That was not a foul. And Kier in her response said this is about not W's and losses. Yes, it is. Because you put your statement

out after you lost when your coach right here, Reeve, the most disgraceful thing I have seen in 50 years of watching basketball, cursing out fans, walking out of the gym, going into the post locker room, the media room,

and killing the officials. When the official got the call right, I was in the real building with Pat Lally with the Lakers against the Celtics with Rambis. I was there when Pat Lally got burned with Hugh Hollins on a call by Hubert Davis for the Celtics, which gave the Bulls wins.

That was a incredibly horrendous decision.

It was a reverse Phil Jackson got burned.

No, John, terrible, terrible job by Reeve. She should apologize for garbage, ridiculous behavior. I spoke to an NBA official today, who was in the Hall of Fame. He said, Chris, that was a tremendous non-call. She, the officials did the exact right thing. Kier says it's not about W's and L's.

Yes, it is. You lost the game. You lost the ball and you're frustrated. B, your coach acted like a complete, you don't act like that. You don't act like that.

And she should apologize. You know what? I was at of line. The court was right. I can't run in the court, curse out the fans, and then on top of it, destroy the officials on my season. She deserved the suspension. Now, we get that out of the way.

This is, Steve, about labor negotiations. You have been around forever. We have seen the NFL lose games. We have seen the NBA lose games. They lost a half a season in 99 with the strike. We have seen baseball get amputated and lose a World Series. I saw people kill Selig. I saw people kill Stern. I saw people kill Roselle and tag the Abou because they were frustrated with the CBA. This is the same deal. They're annoyed that the CBA

is not yet solved and as a a result, they're frustrated. She's mad by a call, and she's going crazy.

This will get settled when they negotiate a deal in October. I'll add to that, but I know Monica wants to say something. We got her on remote. Go ahead, Monica. You speak first, and then I'll follow.

Okay. The only thing I got to check you on, Doggy, because you're right. Right, CBAs can be contentious, and commissioners have an agenda, and players have an agenda, and if this does head toward a lockout in the WNBA, then so be it. But I do have to check you, because she started that statement and said, "'Congratulations to the Phoenix Mercury.'"

I completely disagree that this statement was in any way connected to the fact that they lost. In fact, should the Lynx have made it to the finals? Should the Lynx have possibly been the finals champion? Ultimately, I still think that based on what is happening currently and who Nafisa Collier is working closely with Nneka Ogumoke, Brianna Stewart, the entire WNBA Players Union,

this statement was still probably going to come at some point, particularly women around the league. To your point, Stephen A, have really harped on hoping that the statements about being grateful and thanking Kathy Engelbert are not true. Now, I have no reason to believe

that Nafisa Khali would bring those statements to the table if they were not true. But I do want to be very clear. If we had woke up and did your program immediately after the Lynx lost to the Mercury, then I would have been here for the debate over the call. But I assure you that this is not related to that because of who Nafisa Khalil is to this league currently and the future of the league moving forward.

How about the coach? How about getting on her? That was despicable what she did.

Doggy, listen, Cheryl Reeve is a Hall of Famer.

I don't care if she's a Hall of Famer? She acted terribly. You can't act like that.

You're going to let me talk. You're going to let me talk.

Go ahead.

I agree. She acted terribly. She was suspended. In that moment, this is what I'm saying to you. We don't get to a place where someone as measured and poised as Nafisa Khalil goes to the podium if not, this inconsistency and the, quite frankly, the way the players are framing it,

poor officiating has not reached an absolute boiling point. I assure you that Shorie was probably not proud of this moment. She was suspended and rightfully so. You cannot do this, but this is what I'm telling you. This is why we are in this position

as far as consumers of the WNBA. The distance between the players and the coaches and the league office is far apart. That, what you witnessed, while it was not acceptable, I agree, is an absolute boiling point of issues that the players feel the league has negated to address in terms of officiating and player safety all season long. But I agree with you. Not that it was what you

would expect for normal basketball behavior. Let me jump in here. First, a couple of things. Number one, you're absolutely right. The behavior of the coach was despicable, no doubt about that. I think there's still residue from last year's WNBA Finals when they lost because they blamed the officiating bench. She hasn't let that go and she had that chip on her shoulder all season long.

And I think that's what happened in the players, because she reached the ball and point, she's about to go home. She knew it. And obviously, that was an ugly situation. But there's no reason for her to act that way. You're absolutely right. And the coach deserved to be suspended. And she should be embarrassed by her behavior. Let's get that out the way, because that's

separate and apart from this. All right? We also need to get out the way, even negotiation is going on. The New York Post reported last October that the WNBA had lost approximately $40 million. So when the players show up at All-Star Weekend and they're talking about pay us what you owe us, I didn't think it was the greatest negotiating tactic,

per se, but I got their point because just because you might have lost money as a league doesn't mean that it's their fault because the bottom line is they're doing what they're supposed to do because the quality of the product has elevated exponentially and you can just be looking at how the WNBA is doing business and you may have some challenges there. I get that part. This is

not about that stuff. This is not just about Collective Bargaining. This is about that Commissioner, Kathy Engelbert. Listen to what Nafisha Khalia said. The kind of things that she was talking about. Look at the stuff that's been reported about her. I don't know. I met her once or twice. Seemed like a very nice lady, but I don't know her. But I will tell you this.

When you are a commissioner, and people are saying you're not a people person, and they've got quotes of you being dismissive of stars in the league, and they don't matter to you, and you know what? They wouldn't be anything without us. They should thank their lucky stars.

They're even in this uniform. Like, wait a minute. Why can't you thank your lucky stars that you're in a position to be a commissioner of a sports league? Who the hell are you to say something like that?

That's why I believe she should resign. Because if somebody talked about me, you, or whomever, with such specificity.

Strong denial.

All right, and on top of it all, it involved private conversations between us that you have now publicized to ridicule and besmirch my name, my reputation. Oh, hell no, I'm not coming out with that weak ass. I, for the third time, I'm saying that weak ass statement. You are the commissioner of

the WNBA. Now maybe I'm spoiled. Maybe I'm spoiled, but let me, let me tell you something right now. I grew up covering David Stern. My God, if somebody somebody had If they even thought about speaking about him that way publicly you you better put up barricades For what's coming your way from that man? You understand what I'm saying? It ain't happening It ain't I'm telling you right now and he put he was the commissioner when Jordan was in the league when a large one was in the league, when Olajuwon was in the league, when Kareem and Magic and Bird and Isaiah and these boys were in the league, okay?

When Isaiah was the president of the Players Association, okay, and they wouldn't think of doing something like that publicly. So when you got a player that speaks with such specificity about the character of a leader. If that leader doesn't raise holy hell

and stand up for themselves as an individual, you don't deserve to lead. And that is my position on Kathy Engelbert today. Respectfully, I'm not questioning her qualification or anything, but her timid response to that direct assault on her

leads Nafisha Kalia to be significantly more believable. And if that's the case, you gotta go.

The one thing about the officials, officials in all sports screw up. Look at the umpires with this and 26 strikes. Ask the Jets on Monday night on the officials there. Go ask Sean Payton in the championship game. Nicole Robey Coleman.

On the plate.

Go ask him. So the idea that somehow, someway, the WNBA officiating is infinitely worse than the other sports is a bunch of nonsense. Secondly, they only play 30-something games. These are not full officiated guys.

That's like the NFL. They're part-timers because it's not a full, it's not a full season. That's not any two games. It's not seven months. So they're part-time officials.

They're part-time.

Okay.

Okay. All right, dog. This was actually the first 40 game season that we went through. I disagree, but we're not gonna get stuck there. This is what I'll say as we wrap this thing up, y'all. We are in an interesting place in women's sports. And we had seen this sort of in the college ranks,

particularly when we go back to the NCAA tournament of 2020, where the players call out the inequities between the women's NCAA tournament and March Madness Experience versus the men. So we've seen this brewing, right? right, where, and I can say this as a women's basketball athlete, where it goes from a gratitude and a thankfulness for the opportunity to play to Doggy's point.

This was the first year of a 40-game season in the WNBA. There is sort of this air around women's sports of thanking media for being there and being happy to have the opportunity. That has changed. Times are changing. And so we are seeing women athletes at the collegiate level,

at the pro level, demand that they be treated like first-class athletes. And to me, again, to Stephen A.'s point, for Nafisa Khalil to now begin to reveal pieces of private conversations, and she said in her four-minute-long statement that she had tried to have a number of behind-the-scenes and private conversations that were not getting the results that she wanted. To be at this point where everything is, so to speak, on front street, to me, indicates what I'm very proud to be a part of.

That women's athletes, particularly these women's basketball players, are tired of being treated as second class and moving forward it is no longer acceptable.

But let's say this, she's saying she's being treated as second class by another woman. Let's be very, very clear about that. This isn't, this isn't, this isn't some man, you understand as the commissioner of the league, you know, not being relatable to women and what they bring to the table. This is a woman who has climbed the charts in the world of

business. According to Nafisha collar, This is a woman who has climbed the charts in the world of business, according to Nafisha Khalid, being dismissive of other women and impeding the progress. She didn't say the league. She said, ha, you can't lead after that. You shouldn't be at the negotiating table on behalf of the WNBA. If that's what a body of players feel about you as an individual, they didn't she did not say the leak.

She said,

huh,

that's a problem. You can't have that woman leading you in the negotiations. You're not gonna have any faith. You can't have her lead in a way. No disrespect to Kathy Engelberg. I'm not questioning her qualifications

at all. I'm just talking about what this young lady said and that response. I'm sorry. She's welcome to come. You call the first take right now. Explain. Because my question to her is going to be, how come you didn't respond to that? How you just go letting Nafisha Kyle you say that and you come out with again that weak ass statement. It was weak He's trying to bring the temperature that you can't bring the temperature not that doggy you you can't somebody attack you like that Ain't no temperature down. You know, did you say that when Bryce Harper got in the face a Rob Manfred in the duck? We didn't see the cameras. There was no statement

We didn't know that you heard about it and you appalled that Bryce Harper would talk to the commissioner like that. But she could go and give a damn press conference with a red statement detailing how she feels about you and why and speaking on behalf of other players. And you, that, you come out with that statement? Oh, go home, go home.

You make it, couldn't you? You make it, couldn't you?

Go home, CNA.